Lois & Clark Forums Forums Fan Fiction Lois & Clark Fanfic Bad News - Comments -- or News can be bad if it is confusing

look, I like the idea of the twist in the tale....
and it works story wise...

but I am a little confused (for lack of a better word)

My Father is a psychiatrist, and I have worked with him as a secretary in the past...
Psychiatric illness is a grave and serious matter, and although manageable, it sort of touches a lot of nerves with me if I see people joking around about it... not that I take personal offence nor do I think that you intended to offend... just that It is sort of an area where I feel off at the thought of jokes made on the subject


I dont know what I am asking, just make sure in the future to be careful abbout such posts...
you would never get away with a racist/sexist/other prejudiced joke online.... why should it be different for the mentally ill, because they suffer tremendously with their handicaps, and don't need any more sufering through the promotion of negative stereotypes and jokes etc.

(NOTE: YOUR STORY did NOT have such bad connotations nor was it overtly offensive, but please be careful...)

Beethoven, what story is this for? Having worked as a psychiatric nurse, I'd like to read it.

EDIT: Well, I think I figured out which story this is. But if it's the one I read, I didn't think any thing was wrong with it at all.

I also have to say that one of the ways psych patients cope with their illnesses (some of which are devastating) is laughing at themselves. (Of course, that won't work if they are paranoid.)

He is talking about *Bad News*

YES I was talking about bad news...
but not that I think the author was offensive,
I just wanted to remind you FoLCs out there to be careful...

As I said, if an offensive comment was made around any other minority/disadvantaged group in the community, then all hell would break loose...

Even if humour is the best medicine,

A major issue I have found out in the community is of the horrors behind the stigma of mental illness,
People would actively take dangerous drugs, alcohol, nicotine, etc. rather than seek treatment for treatable illnesses such as depression, anxiety, etc. in order to avoid the stigma behind mental illness.

Yes, I rather thought it was Bad News. Can you edit your title to reflect that? I've also been known to say something about psychiatric issues, but it almost seems as if you thought the the story was being irreverent. I didn't get that at all. Mary plainly said that the story was her try at angst.


Yes, this is true. A good percentage of drug / alcohol addicts are trying to self treat a mental illness (and sometimes a physical illness). And sometimes there is a stigma attached, but this is changing - at least in the states. And I can tell you that having worked with both psych patients and addicts that they do laugh at themselves and that it usually is the best medicine. I don't think Mary's intention was to poke fun in any way.

I don't quite get what you are trying to tell us, Beethoven.

I was born in Germany and I still live there, happily almost every day. It's the country with about the worst history that I know of. I don't think anything can be compared to Holocaust.

It has happened more than 60 years ago and still my language is full of pitfalls. Some words can't be used, because they got a bad connotation for now and forever. We have to be more careful with what we say than other people. So I guess you can say that I'm familiar with sensitive topics.

I agree with you that sensitive topics should be handled very carefully. And Mary did so. Her story certainly wasn't a joke.

What do you want to do? Not write about racism, handicapped people and mental ilnesses? I think it is allowed, *must be* allowed to write about such things, if we do it respectfully.

As you pointed out, mental illnesses are a part of people's lives. Racism unfortunately is a part of our lives as well. As such I think they have a place in fandom, in stories in general.

Of course it would be fatal to write a story about Clark becoming a racist and imply that this can be considered a good thing. But I don't think that anyone here would do such a thing. From what I read over the past month, I have the impression that all the writers and readers are rather considerate people. And I don't think that anyone would write about a topic that he or she can't handle with the due respect.

I liked the twist. I, too, expected to hear Bernie Klein tell Superman that he couldn't have children. But to hear Dr. Friskin tell Superman that his son was mentally ill was a shock. And I knew that there was no joke attached to this. Mary plainly stated that this offering wasn't a funny one. So if you're offended, Beethoven, it's because you didn't read the whole post.

My first thought, after reading the final line, was that our world would not be able to handle a super-powered schizophrenic. How will Superman's son be treated? Could any standard treatment help him? Will he need to be isolated form the population? Can anyone besides his father control him if he becomes delusional or even violent? And how will his mother react?

This would be terrible news. I can't imagine much that would be worse for any father to hear. My heart goes out to the whole family.

I agree with everybody else here. Mary wasn't trying to be flippant or poke fun about schizo. And even if she were, there's making fun in a good way and making fun in a bad way.

My little bro is autistic and though it's hard to be reminded daily that there's lots of things he'll never be able to experience in life, we keep ourselves upbeat by making jokes about it. As his eldest sister, I'd never want im to somehow feel himself somebdoy to be pitied or unable to accept his condition. We've taught him all sorts of autism jokes and our family can take most things in stride by now. We actually encourage outsiders to joke about it, so as to ease them out of the awkwardness of the situation.

Humour can be a step towards acceptance too. =)

And if it's illnesses like schizo you're talking about, well my cousin used to be one for years and he HATED people tip toeing about the subject. MOst of the family schizo jokes were made up by him, as I recall. (All of them really lame. :rolleyes: )

I think what matters is not the irreverence, but the intent. Although I understand what you say about possibly being misunderstood. =)

First of all, thank you to everyone who flocked to my defense; as the author in question, though, I must add my own response.

I read somewhere that few people ever read the forewords, prefaces, and introductions of books. I guess this same is true for Author's Notes on fanfic.<g>

I was not trying to make a joke here. Yes, I have a reputation for being one of the clowns of this fandom; but every now and then, I hear the siren song of "serious writing".

Perhaps the "Twist" threw some people off; it is awfully close to my style of punch-line. If I have offended, I apologize, though this was certainly not my intent.

In fact, I'll let you all in on a little secret.

You may notice that I said in my Author's Note that the vignette was written while I considered what to do with another Help-I've-Bitten-More-Than-I-Can-Chew angst fic I was writing, called White-Washed History . I didn't want to say in the notes, because it would spoil the end, but this is meant to be a part of the story's canon (check out the first segment). I've been considering abandoning this fic and maybe writing its prequel instead (which would expand on the vignette you've just read).

As much as I love a joke, I like to think I know when to shut up. I try to be as respectful as I can with topics that warrant it. (I've used homosexuality as a punchline at times, but never knowingly as a "Ha Ha, look at the gay person!" kind of situation. The joke was usually at someone else's expense...all two times. :rolleyes: )

But thank you for the friendly warning. Yes, I will try to be careful.

I would tend to agree that the world would have difficulty handling a super-powered schizophrenic. I’d think most medications would be useless - maybe injections might work. There very well could be times when he would have to be isolated. But even his father might have difficulty controlling him if he was delusional or violent. It is very difficult for one person to control a violent schizophrenic, so how would Clark handle someone that had at least part of the strength that he had?


Schizophrenics sometimes tend to have enhanced senses, so would that mean his sense of hearing might be even more acute than Clark’s?


Yes, I agree.

Its not so much that I was offended, but confused...
as you said yourself,
I know you were not trying to offend... but the confussion made me at first unable to fully appreciate your sincerity... as long as you were sincere in your story, I am happy

Could the world tolerate a superpowered schizophreniac? I wonder. Somehow, I think that Jason Trask - or, at the very least, what was left of Bureau 39 - would get many new friends.

Ann

I have to admit that I don't know very much about schizophrenia. But from what I heard, I can say that people suffering from this disease are not frequently violent towards others. They tend to be aggressive towards themselves, hearing voices that tell them to commit suicide.

They might be afraid of people who wear blue jeans or think that wearing a certain hat will keep them save from rays from outer space. Something like that.

Of course we can't be sure how a superpowered man would react if he felt threatened by people wearing jeans, because he thinks that they are watching his every step. Maybe he would be aggressive, knowing that those people can't overpower him. But on the other hand there are so many people with jeans that he can't possibly attack them all. And in his troubled mind I guess he would assume that the remaining people in blue jeans will tell some superior might about his actions.

Superpowers or not, I think that a schizophrenic son of Superman would probably behave like most other schizophrenics and would rather try to kill himself than others. I might be wrong. I'm sure Beethoven and Nancy know more about the disease than I do.

Yes, most are not violent with others, but some can be.

Continuing what I said above... What you said above is exactly right, but if they are extremely paranoid or delusional, they can become violent. For instance, I have somewhat long hair. At one point, it was about 1/2 way down my back and I came to work with it hanging down. I later got hot and put it up with a hairclip. Well, one patient who was paranoid decided that the 'government' had done this to my hair and that I now had radio beams or some such coming out of my head which were monitoring his and every other patients every move. He got quite worked up about the whole situation and could well have become violent. Some people probably would have called him violent because he yelled and screamed a lot and threatened to do more. Even letting my hair back down did not help the situation. So this is just one situation where someone suffering from paranoia could have been dangerous to others. If this had happened on the street rather than in the hospital, I could very much have seen this man attacking me.

I don't know about the rate or risk of suicides in schizophrenics. I did see a recent article that said that the risk might be less than previously thought.

As long as we are talking about psychiatric issues (sorry for hijacking your FDK thread, Mary), let me take this opportunity to explain that schizophrenia is not the same as multiple personality disorder. (It's also not the same as bipolar disorder or manic-depression.) Many people think that shizophrenia means multiple personalities. It doesn't. I think that may happen because of the paranoia and delusions that a schizophrenic can suffer and they sometimes seem to be 'another person' or have another personality, but that's just their delusional / paranoid thoughts coming out. (Of course, there are instances where both multiple personality disorder and schizophrenia can occur simultaneously, but that's a whole other conversation because some psychiatric folks don't believe that multiple personality disorder truly exists.)

Nah, go right ahead.
I find this discussion very fascinating, and am glad for the chance to learn from people who know more than I do. In fact, this thread is helping to get my juices flowing on the afore-mentioned fics! Maybe I won't abandon it/them after all...

I don’t have a dad because he is a paranoid schizophrenic. My Mum goes through period of great anxiety and depression. I feel into the depths of depression for a several years and still fight with anxiety today. I thank my lucky stars I didn't get it. I had a 50% chance last I checked of possibly having it 'mild' (nurture & nature deal). I like to ignore that stat. Stat can weeble woble. My family has a commonality where we have gone to school to study such things. I have worked in a psych ward, with ill children and adults. I worked in a hospital for 10 years and just a portion was in the psych ward. So my comments will come from this corner of the human experience, like many of you.


I have not read the story, but I shall.
___
I’m back.

I guess I'll just be repeating the above. I don't mean to beat...well you're beating something. I can't remember the saying. Gee. I guess I should go to bed.

I don’t think it was poking fun at all. It was a to the point sad story. Once where such professionals have to deal with such sadness, something I am glad I decided not to do. I know I would take it home.

I’ve met some with this affliction/disease and yes it can be taxing on their lives and their drugs can make them feel like a fake person, but it can offer insight into a world and spawn creativity. My father was tormented by it, but at times was able to create something beautiful out of it to inspire others. We *had* to look at the good times. There were VERY few. He was an artist and unfortunately would destroy all his pieces, but because he was an artist he had an extra hand to describe what he was going through and to illustrate how his world was different. I’m sure he’d escape it if he could, but to see different takes on reality (even if your brain is manipulating it into a false reality) is interesting.

I, like those above, do not see what part of the story would have created this reaction. The point of the story was not humour, but just to trick the mind that we are normally used to the doctor being Klien, not Frisken. Something to make us think, read and reflect on I’m sure. Sometimes people the muse takes us in this direction, a direction I feel can be explored without worry.

I have always had the worry in the back of mind that this could happen to me, but looking at the stats…it alleviates my worries, but they are still there. The Kents have a tough road ahead. Hopefully it won’t be a extremely serious case.

I enjoyed this time to reflect and will look forward to your comedies that you do so well (I enjoy it all}.

My heart goes out to the Kents to the trying times ahead. I can’t imagine how hard it would be for a super powered schizophrenic to handle life. They are a great fictional family and I think they would be some of the best people to provide support and guidance. Of course I know that isn’t a magical ‘cure’.

Having heightened senses and strength, I wonder if it would make the condition worse. Would the brain be more active? Being 'super' disable the ability to absorb medications? I guess one would need a kryptonite tipped needle? Could such procedures make it even more difficult to persuade the person into therapy? Brings up a lot of interesting questions/situations. Oops, I see someone has already mentioned that.



I don't recall my da's problems, but he is oddly deeply religious to the point of embarrassment. If the person fixated on religion could he/she think of them self as a god/demi-god because they can fly, etc?

I'm sorry it took me so long to read this. I'm scrambling to catch up on my reading.

Great piece and a great community. My mind can have mini-workouts in the evening

Wow. I had no idea, Roo.

*Hugs*

Thanks for sharing, Roo.

((((Roo))))

Ann